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Are You Going To Vote This Weekend ?

es
23 (59%)
o
12 (30.8%)
f I have the time
4 (10.3%)

Total Members Voted: 37

Author Topic: Are You Going To Vote This Weekend ?  (Read 7269 times)

Pandaemonaeon

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« Reply #15 on: November 25, 2011, 10:46:30 AM »
I think all politicians have been throwing a fair amount of crap at each other.
I personally am incredibly dissapointed seeing it, as it really seems that the people who are supposed to be responsible for the future of our nation act like a bunch of 5 year olds.
From the small amount I watched of the political debates, all it needed was a midget cross-dresser and you could have sworn you were watching Jerry Springer.
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« Reply #16 on: November 25, 2011, 10:50:52 AM »
i agree, its poor form, and to be honest most people seem so wrapped up in he said she said bullcrap they dont actually pay attention to the policy going on, how did politicians manage to make policy into shortland street

Skyla

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« Reply #17 on: November 25, 2011, 11:06:04 AM »
I'm usually a national supporter, but I'm still undecided on who I'll vote for this year, Regardless of the pre election promises, when they get into power they do what the damn well want.
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« Reply #18 on: November 25, 2011, 11:21:29 AM »
I haven't decided yet if I'm going to vote or not, probably not. Can i ask the National supporters why you are voting for them? I thought they wanted to get rid of our assests, this stupid new youth rate, just making the rich richer? so you must all be over 20 and financially secure?

Pandaemonaeon

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« Reply #19 on: November 25, 2011, 11:33:08 AM »
There seems to be the common misconception about the SOE that they are trying to sell them off.
The actual intended plan for them (If you are to believe what they are saying) is that they sell 49% of it. Of that 49%, 39% will be sold to New Zealanders with 10% going to overseas. They will still hold the majority share, so the government will still hold the majority meaning that if any changes were suggested nothing can be done unless they agree to it.

I have no issues with a youth wage. I worked while I was at school doing mundane jobs that as far as I'm concerned weren't worth any more than a very low income.

As you have guessed I am over 20 and have a stable job.
I work to be able to afford the lifestyle that I choose to live. I don't see why I should work to pay for someone elses lifestyle.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2011, 11:34:10 AM by Pandaemonaeon »
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« Reply #20 on: November 25, 2011, 12:45:20 PM »
yeah other parties have talked so negatively about the asset sale. and not many people have taken time to look at it and understand it.

we keep control of the assets, and the new income from sales and the new owners are able to put money in to develop the overall asset. making it function better. and then the profits will be reaped, not as large as owning the 100% but we dont have the money to develop it and own it 100%.

And with the youth wage, i think it needs to be there and lower. stay in school listen to your parents and get a education. dont try leave home and grow up faster than you should. Goff wants to Increase the minimum wage, basicly opening the door to crippling the NZ economy.
Its all a ratio, he doesn't seem to understand we cant all be rich, some have to be poor and some rich otherwise its communism and that doesn't seem to work either.

He also goes on to say the rich need to pay more tax, they already pay GST and wage taxes as it is. Theyll end up spending more GST and tax in their lifetime here than we ever will on income tax. We need to increase the incentive for the rich to live in this country, not decrease it.
The majority of the rich own businesses and employ people, If they leave, where does that leave our workers?

John Key is a proven business man, who would you employ to run your business. Someone who has done it successively already, or someone with no idea
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« Reply #21 on: November 25, 2011, 12:46:19 PM »
an email i got explaining how our tax system works. i found it very well written.....



Suppose that every day, ten men go out for beer and the bill for all ten comes to $100...

If they paid their bill the way we pay our taxes, it would go something like this...

The first four men (the poorest) would pay nothing.
The fifth would pay $1.
The sixth would pay $3.
The seventh would pay $7..
The eighth would pay $12.
The ninth would pay $18.
The tenth man (the richest) would pay $59.

So, that's what they decided to do..

The ten men drank in the bar every day and seemed quite happy with the arrangement, until one day, the owner threw them a curve ball. "Since you are all such good customers," he said, "I'm going to reduce the cost of your daily beer by $20". Drinks for the ten men would now cost just $80.

The group still wanted to pay their bill the way we pay our taxes. So the first four men were unaffected. They would still drink for free. But what about the other six men ? How could they divide the $20 windfall so that everyone would get his fair share?


They realized that $20 divided by six is $3.33. But if they subtracted that from everybody's share, then the fifth man and the sixth man would each end up being paid to drink his beer.

So, the bar owner suggested that it would be fair to reduce each man's bill by a higher percentage the poorer he was, to follow the principle of the tax system they had been using, and he proceeded to work out the amounts he suggested that each should now pay.

And so the fifth man, like the first four, now paid nothing (100% saving).
The sixth now paid $2 instead of $3 (33% saving).
The seventh now paid $5 instead of $7 (28% saving).
The eighth now paid $9 instead of $12 (25% saving).
The ninth now paid $14 instead of $18 (22% saving).
The tenth now paid $49 instead of $59 (16% saving).

Each of the six was better off than before. And the first four continued to drink for free. But, once outside the bar, the men began to compare their savings.

"I only got a dollar out of the $20 saving," declared the sixth man. He pointed to the tenth man,"but he got $10!"

"Yeah, that's right," exclaimed the fifth man. "I only saved a dollar too. It's unfair that he got ten times more benefit than me!"

"That's true!" shouted the seventh man. "Why should he get $10 back, when I got only $2? The wealthy get all the breaks!"

"Wait a minute," yelled the first four men in unison, "we didn't get anything at all. This new tax system exploits the poor!"

The nine men surrounded the tenth and beat him up.

The next night the tenth man didn't show up for drinks, so the nine sat down and had their beers without him. But when it came time to pay the bill, they discovered something important. They didn't have enough money between all of them for even half of the bill!

And that, boys and girls, journalists and government ministers, is how our tax system works. The people who already pay the highest taxes will naturally get the most benefit from a tax reduction. Tax them too much, attack them for being wealthy, and they just may not show up anymore. In fact, they might start drinking overseas, where the atmosphere is somewhat friendlier.

David R. Kamerschen, Ph.D.
Professor of Economics.

For those who understand, no explanation is needed.
For those who do not understand, no explanation is possible
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« Reply #22 on: November 25, 2011, 12:54:26 PM »
Could not have said it better
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« Reply #23 on: November 25, 2011, 01:10:06 PM »
And the thing is, the rich man who is paying the most for the beer, probably doesn't even drink it and instead buys his own wine.

My point being, rich people will be sending their kids to private schools, they will use private hospitals. They are not utilising community funded courses or self help services.

So they are paying a hell of a lot more and not actually using the services as much.

Demco

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« Reply #24 on: November 25, 2011, 01:45:17 PM »
Undecided actually greens/labour
« Last Edit: November 25, 2011, 01:46:42 PM by Demco »
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westybob

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« Reply #25 on: November 25, 2011, 03:19:58 PM »
The rich who own most of the wealth pay little tax and won't until there is a comprehensive capital gains tax and Financial Transactions tax and a number of other loopholes are plugged. Recent tax cuts for those wealthy who do pay income tax have increased our debt levels while not showing any of the promised improvement in the economy. This government is run by the rich for the rich and the bottom 80% of us are falling further behind.

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« Reply #26 on: November 25, 2011, 03:21:24 PM »
Quote from: westybob;584260
The rich who own most of the wealth


No sh!t, that's why they're rich? >_>
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Pandaemonaeon

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« Reply #27 on: November 25, 2011, 03:27:04 PM »
Quote from: westybob;584260
The rich who own most of the wealth pay little tax and won't until there is a comprehensive capital gains tax and Financial Transactions tax and a number of other loopholes are plugged. Recent tax cuts for those wealthy who do pay income tax have increased our debt levels while not showing any of the promised improvement in the economy. This government is run by the rich for the rich and the bottom 80% of us are falling further behind.

I'm 99% sure that I'm in the bottom 80% and I don't feel that I'm falling further behind.

A couple of questions I ask of you.
At what point do you feel that someone becomes rich?
If you were suddenly in the situation where you were one of the rich, and ended up losing more than 50% of your income due to tax do you think it would be fair?
« Last Edit: November 25, 2011, 03:29:23 PM by Pandaemonaeon »
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« Reply #28 on: November 25, 2011, 03:29:25 PM »
yeah same, im no where near the top brackets on NZ. self employed, 25 yrs old. and i manage fine. im not falling behind, plenty of work. and cannot be more happier at tough times like this when i look at other economies suffering around the world.
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Sectiplave

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« Reply #29 on: November 25, 2011, 04:01:13 PM »
Already voted this morning, I'm a lefty.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2011, 04:02:23 PM by Sectiplave »